Episode 11: Lindsay C.M. Garrett, LCSW
Welcome to season two of What Your Therapist is Reading. I'm so excited to share over the next couple of weeks what we have in store. To give you an idea, we're going to be talking about using video games and therapy sessions, therapists taking care of themselves, parenting, maternal mental health, great divorce, and a whole host of other things. Make sure you follow along on social media at therapy books podcast to find out if there's a giveaway going on. Several of the authors have provided copies to give out to listeners. So, let's get started.
Welcome to What Your Therapist is Reading. I'm your host, Jessica Fowler. On today's episode, we are speaking with Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW, about her book, Parenting Goals: The Millennial's Guide to New Parenting Preparedness. Lindsay is an expert in the field of adoption, parent preparation, and child welfare. Lindsay is known for her directness with a witty sense of humor, loving others through sharing knowledge and always having a plan.
Lindsay started writing for the Houston Moms blog the same year she became a parent. Her brain tends to sort things out through writing them down. And in her quest to sort through the transition to parenthood, she wrote her first book, Parenting Goals: the Millennial's Guide to New Parent Preparedness.
For her entire career, children have been Lindsay's passion, and by extension, their parents. She has spent 11 years supporting parents through adoption at the Gladney Center for Adoption, and the most inspiring part of her work is seeing the magic and mess of growing families. When she's not working or writing, you can find Lindsay watching as much TV as her kids will allow, organizing life in her bullet journal or baking treats in an introvert's ploy to make friends. Lindsay lives in Spring, Texas with her husband and two children. And as always the information shared on this podcast is for informational and educational purposes only.
Lindsay, thanks so much for coming on the podcast today. I'm excited to talk to you about your new book.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yes. Thank you so much for having me. I love talking about books.
Jessica Fowler: I do too. That's the podcast. So, tell me a little bit about yourself.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yes, I am a licensed clinical social worker in the state of Texas. I have worked in the field of adoption for most of my career working with adoptive parents and adoptees and families as they enter the process and as they experience the transition to parenting. And I am also a parent. I have two kids that are almost five and my youngest will be two next week.
Jessica Fowler: Very nice. Has that played into your role in writing this book between your professional and personal experience?
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yes. So, the book is really a combination of my professional and personal experience. I, when I was talking about becoming a parent, starting to have children, I am like a very type A planner.
I want to have a plan in place for all the things. And, you know, uh, illusion of control, even when there's no control. And I was looking for a book that would help me prepare for the emotional transition of parenting that would help myself and my partner have conversations that we needed to have ahead of time.
So, we weren't having them at 3am when we have a newborn and we're sleep deprived. And I looked and looked and looked and it just didn't exist. And my best friend and sister-in-law, um, as I was complaining to her about it, it was like, you know, you could probably write that if you really wanted to. And I started thinking about the work that I do with adoptive parents, the things that we do to prepare them, the conversations we have, what we assess for, the issues that I've seen come up over and over and over and over in that transition, working with adoptive parents.
And then just my own need and things that I wanted to talk about from a personal standpoint before I became a parent. And I decided, you know what? Yeah, I could write this book. And so, I did. So, the book is, it's really like the book I wish I had before I became a parent.
Jessica Fowler: So, which makes sense because right, a lot of times in going to become a parent, right? I mean, couples may talk about, oh, when are we going to have children and that? Usually it's just kind of stop at the birth, right? We don't put a lot of thought into all the other things that you're talking about in the book.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: And most parenting books are like a how to parent, like, yeah, this is how babies work, feed them, water them, get them to sleep. Um, so much of them are focused on the child and I really wanted something that focused on the transition. For the parents, because the it's huge. It's a huge transition. And the focus is so much more on the baby or the child than it is on the parents.
Jessica Fowler: Yeah. And the relationship to you talk about that in there right it's not just the individual it's a couple to how it's impacting them. So, what are some, what are some of the topics you talk about in the book here to kind of give a highlight of the book.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yeah, I talked about. Have a side if you want to be a parent and conversations to have around that, how to decide how you want to become a parent, uh, working in the world of adoption, uh, biological children is not a given in my brain and in my experience. So, kind of talking to the options of that and how things logistical things that you want to cover like finances. Your expenses are about to skyrocket. So, if you're one of those people who just kind of moseyed along and never had a budget, now would probably be a good time to start doing that. And the most important piece that I'm really passionate about is attachment in our own history from our childhoods and what that means for us going into parenting because we do what we know, and if we haven't explored that piece of our experience, uh, we're going to be just doing whatever our gut tells us. And for some people, that's fine, and for some people, we don't really want to do that. So really examining our own experience as children and being intentional about what kind of parent do I want to be? What experience do I want my children to have? And then ways to stay connected through the transition with your partner, um, for people who are in a relationship, uh, how to maintain that connection, how to keep your communication positive and productive, and how to give your partner grace because the transition is different for everybody and might be more challenging for some people than for others.
Jessica Fowler: I love that you put the attachment. piece in there, and I really loved your analogies with the Disney movies.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Oh yes, yes, that's the, that's the like, peak Disney millennial in me, uh, like, what if we did a Disney analogy for everything?
Jessica Fowler: And if you haven't seen the Disney movie, if you're going to have children, you're probably going to see, you know, the list of Disney movies that you gave. But it is important, it's something, that's what I mean, these are, topics that we don't necessarily think about going into parenthood. We don't think about, oh, what's my attachment style? How's this going to impact my parenting? And you have a chapter in there too, about like, even talking about discipline, you can always just assume that we're on the same page within a relationship, how we're going to parent, but then may not be because raised differently. Right. Well, that's how my parents did it. So that's how. I'm going to do it, or my parents did it this way. So therefore, I'm going to do the exact opposite and not realizing that there's an in between and not having those conversations.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: And I think even more important for this generation of parents, because we're just inundated with information, you know, when our parents were becoming parents and finding their way, they would ask in person, people that were close to them for advice, or they might read a book. Now we have conflicting advice coming at us from everywhere on the internet, and it's hard to figure out what's important and what's not.
Jessica Fowler: Yeah.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Um, so really. discerning that and deciding what's important for you as a family and as a parent before you dive into, you know, 17, 000 reviews on sippy cups, um, can help make things less stressful and crazy down the road.
Jessica Fowler: Absolutely. Even I look at the information. So, my oldest is going to be 12 soon. And my youngest just turned four and the difference in information from my 12 year old, well, there was a lot of information out there, but how it compares, even from just the blogs, telling you how to parent to the products, like everything.
And for, you know, you highlight this generation of all the information and seeking out the information and wanting to do it a certain way. And it's that reminder that when you kind of have to do it works for you, but also, I like to say, and I talk to people all the time about like, just because you brought it somewhere, it doesn't necessarily mean it's true or that it's true for you. Right. And that's the piece to remember and true for your family, right? How do you talk about it? As a family as a couple of what you want to be doing.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yes, and I believe it's in the discipline chapter we talk about creating a mission statement for your family and defining what your values are going to be as a parent. So when you, you know, are down an Instagram rabbit hole with six experts telling you that you have to feed your baby organic food that you've made yourself. If that's not a huge important thing for you and your family, then you don't have to do it.
Jessica Fowler: Yes, I loved that. I love that.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: That was fine. They'll be eating french fries off the floor in a year anyway.
Jessica Fowler: Right. We can go in with this what we think it's going to look like. Yes, but I was going to say too that I, I love that you put that in there. You know, this is a book to read before you get pregnant and to start having those, those conversations in there. Um, and then you have the summaries and the questions at the end of each chapter, right? It gets. It gives whoever's reading that book things to think about and, you know, how do we even start to have these conversations?
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yeah, I wanted to make it really digestible, a little bit fun. I feel like so many, uh, like self-help books are just a slog to get through and, uh, give different options. So, you know, maybe you're a type A person like me and you're going to read the whole thing in order and take notes and highlights and answer all the questions, or maybe you're a skimmer and you're just going to read the summary. And like, maybe answer one question like use how it works for you and or your partner, and there are a lot of options.
Jessica Fowler: Yeah, that is, that is nice about the book. And you also talk about to be aware of things, right? When it comes to postpartum depression and anxiety, I think that that's important to have in there too.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yes. I talk about my own personal experience with postpartum anxiety and how that was a difficult thing for me to recognize, even as a therapist, um, I started, sought treatment for it and started medication at, after I had my second child, but the symptoms that I was experiencing were definitely there with my first, but I didn't really, I thought it was just the transition. I thought it was normal transition. But having two kids and COVID and like all of the heightened stress with my second made me realize, uh, no, like I'm doing all the things I normally do to cope and it's not helping me like it usually does. And, uh, saw a wonderful doctor, went in again, type A, went in with my list of symptoms and expected to really have to add advocate for myself because I have heard um, women who've experienced that, that they have to like convince their doctor that they need help and support and my wonderful doctor was like, no, sounds great. Like let's try this and see how it works. And I described it as, uh, it was like someone turned my brain down like just a little bit, like just enough that that wasn't what I was focusing on all day long.
Jessica Fowler: Oh, with the medication. Yeah, that's how I describe it to that. It, it allows to be able to use the skills more effectively. Right. And kind of just brings that down a little bit, but I appreciate that you put it in there. And I say that about, you know, you joke about the checklist, but realistically those checklists exist because a lot of times women aren't heard or they don't know or understand. Right. Cause they haven't had this experience before and they think it's normal or don't you know, just they don't recognize it, so it's important to keep talking about it, but you do you have that little bit of your own experience in there and then you interview other people and share their experience. You have some humor in there, like I said with the Disney. It's a nice little mix of different experiences with the humor.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yes, I wanted there to be more, more than just my opinion, you know, I am one person, I am a middle class, mental health professional, white, cisgender woman, and that is like one very specific experience and perspective and so I wanted to have a variety of those. I was able to interview 50 parents and include their experiences and answers to their questions. My favorite quote that I can think of off the top of my head was, “Before I became a parent, I thought that I was really good at not getting sick, but after I found out that I was just really good at not letting anyone sneeze in my mouth.”
Jessica Fowler: That is a good one.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yes, it's like a summarization of toddler.
Jessica Fowler: Well I think it's, you know, even just that idea right we're very good at all of these things until we're actually experiencing it. So, what are one or two takeaways you would like your readers to take away from this book?
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yes, I would say the first one is that parenthood and the challenge and the transition of it is something you can actually prepare for. I think a lot of the messages we receive are like, oh, it's just instinct, like you'll just know. And I think that creates for some people a lot of shame because you get into it especially if you're a first time parent, you don't know what you're doing. You may not have an instinct is especially if you have had no experience with babies or children and you're feeling really overwhelmed and then because you don't know what to do, you feel like you're failing because the world has told us, well, you'll just know. Um, which is silly. We get, um, more preparation for getting a driver's license than we do for getting a baby. And the responsibility is so much bigger. So, like you can prepare there are things you can talk about there are things you can learn about being a parent is one of the hardest literally jobs that you will ever have over your lifetime.
And it takes a little while to learn how to do the job, just like with any other new job, and that's okay. And the second thing is, I think a lot of people going into parenthood feel like I don't know anything. I, you know, this is all brand new to me. I've no idea what I'm doing. And I would like to push back on that and say the most important factor in your parenting and how you will interact with your child is you and your history and what you bring to the table. As a human being, your past experiences, how you were parented, and you already know all of that because you lived it and you are an expert in you, in your experience. So even if you've never done this before, the biggest piece of the puzzle, you already have. So, don't be afraid to dive into that and use it to your advantage.
Jessica Fowler: It's super important to know that and understand that what you bring in your own histories. What I say to clients all the time is that the area is that maybe need a little more self-compassion or love or attention are the ones that are children. What I say highlight for us.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: They really do.
Jessica Fowler: They do. You're like, oh, we can get frustrated. Oh wait. That might be a little bit more of something I have to work on. It's just like they take a highlighter. That's how I describe it.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: And my goal is for parents to hopefully start reflecting on those things before they happen. So that in the moment, you can be more self-aware and know like, oh, okay, this is a thing for me. I need to reflect on this and maybe do some work rather than just getting angry at your child or blaming them or feeling so overwhelmed that you can't even recognize it.
Jessica Fowler: And I would add to that, my own takeaway, one of the ones that I think is important is the section on boundaries that I loved your letter about after having your baby.
Like this, this is the goal, right? Because so much time is spent on how to set boundaries with family members, especially when a new baby comes, like who's going to come to the hospital, who's going to be home, right? When there just needs to be boundaries. So many conversations about that. I was like this this is good. This is, I don't know how many people are going to do it, but this is what we're aiming for.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yes. Um, so Jessica's referring to, I wrote an email to all of our family members of like, here's the communication plan. Here is what we ask that you do if you visit us. You are not just here to hang out, you will get a task. Um, here is what we request as parents. Like, let us figure it out. Don't jump in and take over. Uh, and I have a wonderful family who has been dealing with me for my entire life. So, this wasn't a surprise to them. Um, and it led to really clear expectations and people respecting our boundaries, which was great. Everybody's family is different. So, there are some families I know that like you would do that and it would backfire huge. Um, but. The point is having those conversations ahead of time.
Jessica Fowler: Yes.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Um, so that everybody kind of knows what the expectations are and then you can, uh, you can remind them when you're in the moment. Another thing we did that was really helpful for us is I made my husband point of contact for everybody. Because I already did. I already gave birth to a human.
Jessica Fowler: Yeah.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: It was like dealing with that. Uh, so he got to deal with everybody after the birth and that took a lot of the load off of me.
Jessica Fowler: Yes. And I think about, I joke about that, like that's the goal, but the idea of being like, here are some things that you can talk about with your loved ones and that reminder, it's okay like you said, you just gave birth to set up some of these boundaries, to give yourself permission, to take time to heal. To not have to feel like you have to entertain, do the laundry so they could cuddle with baby, whatever. Right. These things that legitimately people worry about in that structure. And so, it's just, you know, sort of that permission is okay to have boundaries. And like you said, right, like if you've never set a boundary, you don't want to give them this letter, but let's maybe talk about it a little.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: And, and knowing yourself and your people, you know, if you know that your mother or mother-in-law is going to drive you nuts, if they stay in your home after you have a baby, like, let's just go ahead and get a hotel room. And maybe you offer to pay for it if you can financially do that kind of like setting yourself up for success in that transition and setting up your people who all. Love and want to support you and that new baby to be able to actually do that and not stress you all out more.
Jessica Fowler: Let them do it in a way that's going to be helpful for you.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Tell the people what you need.
Jessica Fowler: Yes, which is a skill and it can take time, but yeah, it's just, it's having those conversations and that's what I think this whole book is about. Right. Just starting to have those conversations and being aware that these things could be really helpful.
Well, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. I really appreciate it.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Thank you for having me. I love, I love one on one conversations as an introvert.
Jessica Fowler: I could relate to that. So where can our listeners find your book and find you?
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: Yes, so the book is available at all the major real retailers, not realtors, uh, Barnes and Noble, Amazon.
I personally like Bookshop because that supports local bookstores and Indiebound does as well. You can also ask for it at your local bookstore. I prefer a hard copy, like paper copy, um, with most of my nonfiction books because then you can like write all over it and flip back and forth. But it's also available in an e-book if that's more your jam.
There's no audio book because the introvert in me could not bring myself to do that. So, if you're audio, just listen to this podcast over and over, and I am on Instagram as Lindsay CM Garrett, and Facebook as the same. And my website is LindseyCMgarrettlcsw.com.
Jessica Fowler: Excellent. And I'll add. I shared with Lindsay that it can be a beach read if you can see this, it got left on the beach.
Lindsay C. M. Garrett, LCSW: It's a beach read!
Jessica Fowler: It's a beach read, I read it on the beach read and left on the beach. So, it's a good, it's a very helpful book, so all right.
Well, thank you so much. Thank you so much for listening to this week's episode of What Your Therapist Is Reading. Make sure you head on over to the website or social media to find out if there's a giveaway going on.
The information provided in this program is for educational and informational purposes only and although I'm a social worker licensed in the state of New York, this program is not intended to provide mental health treatment and does not constitute a patient therapist relationship.